On the recent Drink Champs episode, Ray Daniels and Mad Skillz put together their Top 5 hip hop list, and their opinions on Eminem couldn’t have been more different.
It all went well with the Top 2 – nobody disputed that Nas and Jay Z deserved their place at the top. However, the discussion around No.3 got heated. Canadian music executive Ray Daniels named Drake as his choice, but nobody else seemed enthusiastic about the pick. Mad Skillz, a rapper who has taught a university course in hip hop, suggested Kendrick Lamar. N.O.R.E. reminded everyone that 50 Cent shouldn’t be left out of the conversation, given his global success. Then DJ EFN said that, by those criteria, Eminem had to be added to the list. And this is where Ray Daniels went nuclear, refusing to include Eminem on the list because, in his view, Marshall “did not play by hip hop rules”. Those rules aren’t clear, but it’s evident that Daniels thinks Eminem doesn’t belong in hip hop culture.
Ray Daniels: Eminem can’t be in the conversation! Because Eminem doesn’t play by the same rules that everybody else in hip hop does. Nor did he have to make a club record to be a star! Jay had to make a club record. DMX! Everybody got to make a club record, a girl record! It’s a whole checklist of shit you got to do to be the number one rapper in hip hop. Eminem made a record dissing his mom and sold more records than anybody. That’s because he’s white. If you say he’s a nice rapper, Eminem is in the Top 5 rappers of all time. But I don’t put him in hip hop, ’cause I think it’s unfair. You’re literally a Mick Jagger competing against niggas that’s rapping. It’s just not fair!
Mad Skillz: But Ray! The white boy can rap. You can say whatever you want to say about the white boy. Yes, he was white. Yes, he got to TRL quicker. Yes, he got to Dr. Dre quicker. He got the endorsements quicker. But at any given time, if you were from hip hop, at any given time, on any given record, you heard that white boy and went, “Damn, he killed that shit”. ’Cause he did. You can’t say he was a whack. He was not Vanilla Ice.
Ray Daniels: I didn’t say he was a whack rapper. I just said he can’t be on the hip hop list to me ’cause he did not play by the rules that everybody has to play by.
Mad Skillz: I can’t respect your list. Your list’s invalid. He’s on the list.
Ray Daniels: How do you consider Eminem? Did y’all hear his verse on “Lean Back”? No disrespect. He didn’t kill it.
Mad Skillz: Nobody killed it on “Lean Back remix”!
Ray Daniels: André 3000. He rode the beat.
Mad Skillz: I don’t even remember André 3000! “Lean Back” Fat Joe? André 3000 wasn’t even on that record! Let’s just be clear. André 3000 was not on “Lean Back”.
Ray Daniels: I’m going to say this. Y’all are both on the same side. You are technical. You are technical. You’re right. I get why y’all see it. I’m saying this from my perspective. You can’t get credit for Eminem. His first record was “Hi! My name is”. Name one nigga that can make that their first single and sell a million records in the first week. He was white!
Mad Skillz: Snoop!
Ray Daniels: Snoop couldn’t have done “My name is Snoop”.
Mad Skillz: Snoop’s first record was “What’s My Name?” He did the same thing!
Ray Daniels: Okay. Which one is more hip hop? “What’s my motherfucking name?” or “Hi, my name is”? It wasn’t hip hop! It’s okay, it’s fine!
DJ EFN: I’m definitely going to go with Snoop. But you heard that record from Em, and you were like, that’s not his best record for us, for the hip hop heads. But we understood what it did or what it was going to do.
Ray Daniels: Eminem is a great rapper. I just hate…
Mad Skillz: You just hate he’s white.
Ray Daniels: No, no, no. I don’t hate it. I just hate that we compare people like Jadakiss to him, and Jadakiss had to play by way different rules than he did. So for me it’s unfair. I’m an executive, bro. I sit in the room when it’s time to make the music, bro. And it’s like, Eminem can always be in that room over here. You ain’t never heard nobody say: “I had that beat before Eminem got it”. It’s like he doesn’t play in the same league as us. And don’t get me wrong, the thing I like most about him is that he loves us, and he represents us, and he calls himself one of us. But inside, it’s hard to compare him to a nigga that got to actually go make what these bitches want from a nigga. He didn’t have to make the records that everybody else had to do. So why are we comparing him to everybody else? That’s my only thing.
N.O.R.E.: Yeah, I understand you; a point made. But it doesn’t take away the fact that he’s nice.
Mad Skillz: Hell no.
And after pointing out that DJ Epps was sitting there with his bleached hair, looking like Stan in 2026, as living proof of Eminem’s influence, the hosts handed the conversation to DJ Epps, who drew the line under the discussion with a question to Mad Skillz:
DJ Epps: So that No.3 spot with Drake, that would be Eminem for you?
Mad Skillz: Yeah, probably.
Fact check:
Snoop Dogg released “What’s My Name?” as his debut solo single in 1993. The song reached No.8 on the Billboard Hot 100, while topping the Billboard Hot Rap Songs for three weeks.
Eminem’s debut single, “Just Don’t Give a Fuck”, was released in 1998. It did not sell millions. It did not even reach the Billboard Hot 100. Eventually, it peaked at No.62 on the Billboard Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Songs and No.5 on the US Hot Rap Songs.
“My Name Is” was Eminem’s second single, and it peaked at No.36 on the Billboard Hot 100. Obviously, there were no million sales in its first week, or any other week.
André 3000 was not on Fat Joe’s official “Lean Back” remix. The track featured Lil Jon, Eminem, Mase, and Remy Martin.
Apparently, Daniels’s main proof of how Eminem was getting it easier from the industry has nothing to do with reality. And while it’s true that Eminem is now playing in a different league, that has less to do with his race and more with his relentless pursuit of perfection. Perhaps that’s why hip hop heads who are able to recognise the talent and have their facts straight have no issue with that.
Another attempt to write Eminem off by focusing on his skin colour and using incorrect facts as the argument was foiled by an artist who is an integral member of hip hop culture and who believes that Eminem belongs to it.
Mad Skillz did not deny that Eminem’s race opened certain doors faster. His point was that access alone cannot explain the records, the verses, the influence, or the respect Eminem earned from other hip hop artists.